The only time in school when disection came about the teacher offered other work to those who didn't want to do it.

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Doesn't expecting the unexpected make the unexpected the expected?
If it makes sense, DON'T do it.

Sadly it was true, I'll try and find the link.

Please do. And from a credible source, NOT the Daily Mail.

Knowing where you "choose" to live and teach, I am not particularly surprised....

That is actually quite insulting. Kids are worthy of education and respect even if they are not middle class. I happen to like very much the class in question. They are very sweet kids.

Oh wait..you think the kids in a top private school would behave differently? Having worked in one of those I can assure you they wouldn't.

My personal eating habits ghave nothing whatsoever to do with what is taught in a class room, as indeed you very well know. And you called me provocative?

It has everything to do with it. I had nothing in my classroom that couldn't be found in butchers shops across the country. Somehow I don't think you'd be half as outraged if I'd said I was showing a sausage or a hamburger in my class.

For anyones information, I will not eat veal, nor pate fois gras as I know how they are produced. Nor will I eat anything produced by Bernard Matthews as a matter of principle. I buy free range eggs whenever possible.

That is only the tip of the Iceberg when it comes to the UK's horrific farming practices. Do you think Bernard Matthews is the only farmer raising animals in horrific conditions? Unless you are willing to give up all dairy products, chicken and pork then you have no claim on the moral high ground when it comes to animal welfare.

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Dropped by to say hi form work.

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What you do today you will have to live with tonight

Bet you wished you hadn't.... ;-)

Look Esme, I don't want to get into a big public discussion about all this, there are other more pressing demands upon my time.

I am well aware of the other schools you have taught in, and yes class and money seems to make little difference to basic behaviour. Sadly. You might actually think it would.

I am not a complete vegetarian, but I do not eat anything like as much meat from dubious sources as I once did. That is not defending any position, just making a statement.

However in terms of animal welfare, I am an activist. No names no packdrill, but I will support various physical actions where proven neccessary. I have been threatened with arrest before now. Places like Huntingdon Sciences makes my blood boil. You have known me long enough to know that.

I do not support vivisection, nor do I support cutting up dead animals in school. It is wrong and should not be allowed. Science teachers do NOT, I repeat do NOT have to teach Biology. If your school requires you to do that then tell them to F off.

EDIT: nevermind. It's not worth it.

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Well i'll say one thing is for sure. This is one group of people that are very passionate about there beliefs and not afraid to express those ideas to the rest of the world, which is the way it should be. Although some are a little zealous. But thats what makes the world so interesting. ;-P

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Well i'll say one thing is for sure. This is one group of people that are very passionate about there beliefs and not afraid to express those ideas to the rest of the world, which is the way it should be. Although some are a little zealous. But thats what makes the world so interesting. ;-P

I'd like to know how something like heart-lung transplants could have been invented without the use of dogs. I'd like to know how chemotherapy and radiotherapy and PET scanning could have been perfected without lil white mice.
Cos thats what they were doing in the building where I first started working.
Oh and something on the 3rd floor that used mice and made a terrble smell, nobody understood what Dr Myant was doing in there until 20 yrs later when someone linked his research (wierd stuff about lipids and cholesterols) with artery problems.

Well i'll say one thing is for sure. This is one group of people that are very passionate about there beliefs and not afraid to express those ideas to the rest of the world, which is the way it should be. Although some are a little zealous. But thats what makes the world so interesting. ;-P

Yup.

I've been a vegetarian for 20 years now. I gave up eating meat because of the way the meat is raised, not because I think there is anything wrong with eating meat.

Dead animal is dead animal, it is what happens to it when it is alive that matters.

There was a time when I wish I could have told schools that I wasn't going to teach Biology, but unfortunately science teachers DO actually have to teach it. Now I am glad I do. Its a very interesting subject.

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Yes Es99 I agree the treatment of some of our domestic farm animals is at best torture, intentional or not! Those animals do feel pain, but i still enjoy a good steak (I like what I like), so I do buy some of my meat at the farmers markets, where I know the beef led a reasonably normal life b4 they were led to slaughter.Other than becoming vegitarian I dont have many more choices.

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Yes Es99 I agree the treatment of some of our domestic farm animals is at best torture, intentional or not! Those animals do feel pain, but i still enjoy a good steak (I like what I like), so I do buy some of my meat at the farmers markets, where I know the beef led a reasonably normal life b4 they were led to slaughter.Other than becoming vegitarian I dont have many more choices.

When I became a vegetarian there were no other choices. Now I've been one too long to consider going back to eating meat.

I guess me and Chris have different priorities, his priority is the welfare of animals. My priority is trying to motivate inner city kids who are in danger of being alienated from the education process. To get them buzzing and excited about a science lesson is what matters to me. Somehow powerpoints and plastic models just don't do that the same way as them actually seeing the things we are talking about.

People may agree or not with my methods, but I've seen the difference it can make to lives.

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Good Morning Es99! ;-P

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I guess me and Chris have different priorities, his priority is the welfare of animals. My priority is trying to motivate inner city kids who are in danger of being alienated from the education process.

That is basically what it is, just different priorities, yes I agree. It seems that I was wrong and science teachers these days now DO have to teach biology. In my view teachers should stand up and fight against that. If a teacher doesn't want to do it, they shouldn't have to. Same for parents they should be allowed to have their kids opt out if they want.

We give humans dignity after death, Its a shame that generally speaking that doesn't happen with animals. There again I suppose its a human trait not to respect what you eat.

I'm not zealous Bruce, I just happen to strongly believe in certain things.

I think i'll just back slowly out of this thread........

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Ok, maybe zealous was a little too strong of a word,no offence intended. Just strong beliefs is fine by me. ;-)
Good Day Chris, not sure what time it is there but its early here 8:45 am.

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No reason to Dan, I think we've said what we wanted. Most people will not agree with my views, but I've spent most of my life supporting minority causes,I'm used to it! Lets put education and animals to bed and move on to some other chit chat, as per the thread title.

Good day to you as well Bruce, amd none taken I can assure you :-) Its 13.45 here and I'm off to do a peer/peer lesson observation. Oh lucky me!

There again I suppose its a human trait not to respect what you eat.

I'm not sure that is true for all. The Northern American indians were illustrated in 'The Last of the Mohicans' when Nathanial Poe killed an elk and the indians offer these words;

"We're sorry to kill you, Brother.
Forgive us. I do honor to your courage and
speed, your strength ... "

I'm sure there are other examples of humans respecting the dead animals that they need to kill for food.

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Good Morning Es99! ;-P

Well it was. Now it's a good afternoon :p

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..some indians - and other tribes - also ate their dead relatives to show respect,
and to let them be a part of those who`s still alive.........

Respect is in our attitude.. no matter if its our gratefulness to have
food to eat, what ever it is, or to say goodbye to our dear ones in the
way we think is right... human or animal.

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There is a notion that God gave Man dominion over the world. Why would God punish the animals with such a cruel master?

--Ariesta Pelai, 1634 A.D.

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